Post by Modesto Anarcho on Feb 26, 2008 19:21:03 GMT -5
Bomb the System: An Interview with Anarchist Graffiti Project, Not My Government
An Interview with Ryan J Saari founder of Not My Government
Walk around the bay area, and you're sure to see the 'star pig', or a picture of a pig's face inside of a police badge. Look closer and you might also see lots of stencils, stickers, and other propaganda that are in the same vein. Not My Government has been creating high class street art for the class war for years, and also runs a website to show others the tools to do the same. This interview appears in Modesto Anarcho #4.
More info on Not My Government can be view at: www.myspace.com/notmygovernment or www.notmygovernment.com
Modesto Anarcho: Can you talk a little bit about the goals of Not My Government, why it exists, how it got started, etc?
Not My Government: The media (stencils, stickers, posters and the website) exist to criticize social, political and economic structures in the USA. To provide free propaganda for people to download and print to use as they see fit. To influence other artists and be a royal pain-in-the-ass to buffers to the point they quit their jobs and start slapping up some stickers instead. Also it would be nice to make a living off it.
I started tabling my art and people kept asking what organization I was in which got me thinking maybe I should get a name. At the same time there was this t-shirt that said "Not My President" with a picture of Bush on it and I kept thinking to myself "Well, if Gore won, he wouldn't be my President either." So I came up with the "Not My Government" t-shirt as a response and shortly after that I named the website as well. The Not My Government website came online in 2003. But I have been doing propaganda since 1996. I started the website in 1997 but it was just piggy-backing on other sites - first my school's, then my brother's.
MA: Is the goal of NMG to politicize graffiti artists or to get radicals into doing graffiti? Or both?
NMG: Well, the goals are set forth by D.O.T.S. (Disciples of the Spray Can) rather than NMG (Not My Government). I see DOTS as the theory and NMG as the practice of that theory. NMG is my art work and my interpretation of DOTS. DOTS is art theory by deconstructing graffiti into religion. It is an attempt to influence traditional graffiti artists (writers, bombers, hip-hop graf, taggers, ego graf) to produce political art on a mass scale. The development of theory interests me because DOTS takes three taboo subjects (politics, religion and graffiti) and makes them one. Originally, it was for me to follow the guidelines that I wrote in the Message - part 1 but I believe there is room in DOTS for others to make their own goals. And all the drunkin rants posing as religion are on NMG website for people to read and yes, godisaspraycan.
MA: What are ways in which anarchists and other radicals can use graffiti, wheat pasting, and other forms of illegal art to aid their various movements?
NMG: It could aid in getting the word out. The best way I think it could aid is that it's a starting point, where a person outside the "movement" can get in touch with others. Of course, this means the person or people putting up the work would put themselves more at risk if they do this, but it could be just a website address. And the risk is worth taking. But we (street artist activists) need to figure out a better way to connect with the viewers and people in struggle against capitalism.
Thankfully, Graffiti is the easiest art form out there to get involved in; all you need is to write something on the wall. And Graffiti has always been a mix of artist being the viewer and the viewer being the artist, but I would like to see it getting more people involved and developing into different styles. Graffiti in some ways is getting pretty uniformed. I hope kids start mixing it up more, using stencils, wheat paste, stickers and throw some free hand in there as well. This unwritten rule of you can't mix stencil with free hand (or free hand and wheat paste) needs to be thrown out the window.
MA: Graffiti as a street culture is very hierarchal. People slash other writers, sometimes there are fights and violence. There is a desire to get known and "come up". Do you think that the underground graffiti scene can be a potential base for radical activity, or do you think that it is already too steeped in its own inner conflicts?
NMG: I never viewed it as hierarchical. I do view it very macho, sexist and juvenile; and totally male dominated. I was in a crew with a president and it didn't mean nothing, all it meant was that f**ker had to call everybody for a meetings and deal with inner crew problems and other nuts. I never felt that I had to follow orders. The fighting and violence go back to the fact that most Graf writers are male and are from the ages of 13 to 18. For some reason, males at this age feel some need to beat the f**k out of each other, them being graffiti artists is just a coincidence. Also, I have heard more than once from writers from cities that without Graffiti they would be dead because Graffiti got them away from gangs. Personally, I don't know if that's true or not; I'm not from the city.
"Getting known, coming up and getting up" is the name of the game at least in the beginning. Then comes style. Then, if you last that long, subject matter comes next. I never viewed "getting known" as a negative. An artist could definitely take a lead but I never saw it as a fight to the top or anything. Take Twist; he was up everywhere and every nickel and dime artist started to look like him. I'm for sure he didn't want that, but he was on "top." But that was '98; where the f**k is he now? No where (in the gallery selling art). Nobody really pays it any mind, maybe people with money (art collectors), but writers sure don't.
Also, I always thought it was pretty awesome that Graf writers were bombing the f**k out of the city while all these f**k heads just sat on their hands complaining but never got off their ass voluntarily to do anything about it. Graffiti is always about action. I go as far as you're only a Graffiti artist when you're in the act of doing it - before and after you're just like everybody else. Also it's a hella lot of fun getting up.
"…can be potential base for radical activity…or is it already too steeped in its own inner conflicts?" Not any more or less then any other subculture is. Other than the system of capitalism, the biggest problem for Graf is that there are not enough women doing it.
MA: In Washington DC, anarchist graffiti artist BORF was recently arrested. There is also the "green scare" and an ongoing backlash against anarchists and other radicals. Are you ever afraid that putting a public face to your work will make you a victim of government repression?
NMG: BORF - I didn't know he got arrested again. I remember it was 2004 or 2005? Personally I would never have heard of him if he didn't get arrested.
Am I afraid putting a public face on my work? Sure. But it's not gonna stop me. In recent history I have been putting my name out there more then ever.
As for backlash against Anarchists/radicals, I feel it goes in cycles. Right now, the Government is coming at us hard. We really need to broaden our work and outreach to people so we can turn this nuts around. Also, for an anarchist, just living under any government is being a "victim of government repression." Living day to day in this system of nuts its real easy to lose sight that pretty much anything a person can do is attach to some kind of government repression. So much so that it becomes "normal" and we don't pay any attention to it. So I guess the trick is to pay attention to it and do something to change it and bringing your friends and neighbors with you.
MA: Graffiti and street art (everything from wheat-paste murals to stickering) is one of the easiest things that people can do to create revolutionary messages throughout their landscape. What things would you suggest young people begin engaging in if they are interested in hitting the streets?
NMG: I'm a big believer in trial and error. Give yourself some time to figure things out; I'm talking years here, not days. It takes time to develop style and technique. Also look at examples of other artists. Don't pretend you're the only one doing such things; talk to others and share ideas. If you have internet access, check out visualresistance.org/wordpress/zine. It is a 'how to make street art' page and tells you all the basics.
MA: Do you think that radicals looking to do street art should try and work in teams, or should people stick to working as individuals?
NMG: I have done both and I have no personal problem with either. If it's a group thing, I have to trust everybody in that group with my freedom and visa versa. This might make things go slow at first cause everybody is getting a feel of how much risk they're willing to take with each other. When you're by yourself, you don't need to worry about any of that but it's harder doing larger things. So I try to do both. When I'm in a group, I get into political discussions and grow from it. Also if your in a group its easier to start doing other radical work and organize other actions against the state.
MA: What is NMG working on right now that you want people to know about? How can people support your work?
NMG: Right now I'm working on the star pig posters (limited edition screen prints). It's gonna be about 11 or 12 different posters. And DOTS poster series is done and are for sale on the website. Also as always I am making free download posters, stencils and sticker masters for the website. I am going to do a Graf-zine of all East Bay Graf. And a graphic novel if my brother ever gets off his ass and gets his nuts together.
More info (and to download all of Modesto Anarcho #4), go to: www.geocities.com/anarcho209 or www.myspace.com/modanarcho, email us at: anarcho209@yahoo.com
An Interview with Ryan J Saari founder of Not My Government
Walk around the bay area, and you're sure to see the 'star pig', or a picture of a pig's face inside of a police badge. Look closer and you might also see lots of stencils, stickers, and other propaganda that are in the same vein. Not My Government has been creating high class street art for the class war for years, and also runs a website to show others the tools to do the same. This interview appears in Modesto Anarcho #4.
More info on Not My Government can be view at: www.myspace.com/notmygovernment or www.notmygovernment.com
Modesto Anarcho: Can you talk a little bit about the goals of Not My Government, why it exists, how it got started, etc?
Not My Government: The media (stencils, stickers, posters and the website) exist to criticize social, political and economic structures in the USA. To provide free propaganda for people to download and print to use as they see fit. To influence other artists and be a royal pain-in-the-ass to buffers to the point they quit their jobs and start slapping up some stickers instead. Also it would be nice to make a living off it.
I started tabling my art and people kept asking what organization I was in which got me thinking maybe I should get a name. At the same time there was this t-shirt that said "Not My President" with a picture of Bush on it and I kept thinking to myself "Well, if Gore won, he wouldn't be my President either." So I came up with the "Not My Government" t-shirt as a response and shortly after that I named the website as well. The Not My Government website came online in 2003. But I have been doing propaganda since 1996. I started the website in 1997 but it was just piggy-backing on other sites - first my school's, then my brother's.
MA: Is the goal of NMG to politicize graffiti artists or to get radicals into doing graffiti? Or both?
NMG: Well, the goals are set forth by D.O.T.S. (Disciples of the Spray Can) rather than NMG (Not My Government). I see DOTS as the theory and NMG as the practice of that theory. NMG is my art work and my interpretation of DOTS. DOTS is art theory by deconstructing graffiti into religion. It is an attempt to influence traditional graffiti artists (writers, bombers, hip-hop graf, taggers, ego graf) to produce political art on a mass scale. The development of theory interests me because DOTS takes three taboo subjects (politics, religion and graffiti) and makes them one. Originally, it was for me to follow the guidelines that I wrote in the Message - part 1 but I believe there is room in DOTS for others to make their own goals. And all the drunkin rants posing as religion are on NMG website for people to read and yes, godisaspraycan.
MA: What are ways in which anarchists and other radicals can use graffiti, wheat pasting, and other forms of illegal art to aid their various movements?
NMG: It could aid in getting the word out. The best way I think it could aid is that it's a starting point, where a person outside the "movement" can get in touch with others. Of course, this means the person or people putting up the work would put themselves more at risk if they do this, but it could be just a website address. And the risk is worth taking. But we (street artist activists) need to figure out a better way to connect with the viewers and people in struggle against capitalism.
Thankfully, Graffiti is the easiest art form out there to get involved in; all you need is to write something on the wall. And Graffiti has always been a mix of artist being the viewer and the viewer being the artist, but I would like to see it getting more people involved and developing into different styles. Graffiti in some ways is getting pretty uniformed. I hope kids start mixing it up more, using stencils, wheat paste, stickers and throw some free hand in there as well. This unwritten rule of you can't mix stencil with free hand (or free hand and wheat paste) needs to be thrown out the window.
MA: Graffiti as a street culture is very hierarchal. People slash other writers, sometimes there are fights and violence. There is a desire to get known and "come up". Do you think that the underground graffiti scene can be a potential base for radical activity, or do you think that it is already too steeped in its own inner conflicts?
NMG: I never viewed it as hierarchical. I do view it very macho, sexist and juvenile; and totally male dominated. I was in a crew with a president and it didn't mean nothing, all it meant was that f**ker had to call everybody for a meetings and deal with inner crew problems and other nuts. I never felt that I had to follow orders. The fighting and violence go back to the fact that most Graf writers are male and are from the ages of 13 to 18. For some reason, males at this age feel some need to beat the f**k out of each other, them being graffiti artists is just a coincidence. Also, I have heard more than once from writers from cities that without Graffiti they would be dead because Graffiti got them away from gangs. Personally, I don't know if that's true or not; I'm not from the city.
"Getting known, coming up and getting up" is the name of the game at least in the beginning. Then comes style. Then, if you last that long, subject matter comes next. I never viewed "getting known" as a negative. An artist could definitely take a lead but I never saw it as a fight to the top or anything. Take Twist; he was up everywhere and every nickel and dime artist started to look like him. I'm for sure he didn't want that, but he was on "top." But that was '98; where the f**k is he now? No where (in the gallery selling art). Nobody really pays it any mind, maybe people with money (art collectors), but writers sure don't.
Also, I always thought it was pretty awesome that Graf writers were bombing the f**k out of the city while all these f**k heads just sat on their hands complaining but never got off their ass voluntarily to do anything about it. Graffiti is always about action. I go as far as you're only a Graffiti artist when you're in the act of doing it - before and after you're just like everybody else. Also it's a hella lot of fun getting up.
"…can be potential base for radical activity…or is it already too steeped in its own inner conflicts?" Not any more or less then any other subculture is. Other than the system of capitalism, the biggest problem for Graf is that there are not enough women doing it.
MA: In Washington DC, anarchist graffiti artist BORF was recently arrested. There is also the "green scare" and an ongoing backlash against anarchists and other radicals. Are you ever afraid that putting a public face to your work will make you a victim of government repression?
NMG: BORF - I didn't know he got arrested again. I remember it was 2004 or 2005? Personally I would never have heard of him if he didn't get arrested.
Am I afraid putting a public face on my work? Sure. But it's not gonna stop me. In recent history I have been putting my name out there more then ever.
As for backlash against Anarchists/radicals, I feel it goes in cycles. Right now, the Government is coming at us hard. We really need to broaden our work and outreach to people so we can turn this nuts around. Also, for an anarchist, just living under any government is being a "victim of government repression." Living day to day in this system of nuts its real easy to lose sight that pretty much anything a person can do is attach to some kind of government repression. So much so that it becomes "normal" and we don't pay any attention to it. So I guess the trick is to pay attention to it and do something to change it and bringing your friends and neighbors with you.
MA: Graffiti and street art (everything from wheat-paste murals to stickering) is one of the easiest things that people can do to create revolutionary messages throughout their landscape. What things would you suggest young people begin engaging in if they are interested in hitting the streets?
NMG: I'm a big believer in trial and error. Give yourself some time to figure things out; I'm talking years here, not days. It takes time to develop style and technique. Also look at examples of other artists. Don't pretend you're the only one doing such things; talk to others and share ideas. If you have internet access, check out visualresistance.org/wordpress/zine. It is a 'how to make street art' page and tells you all the basics.
MA: Do you think that radicals looking to do street art should try and work in teams, or should people stick to working as individuals?
NMG: I have done both and I have no personal problem with either. If it's a group thing, I have to trust everybody in that group with my freedom and visa versa. This might make things go slow at first cause everybody is getting a feel of how much risk they're willing to take with each other. When you're by yourself, you don't need to worry about any of that but it's harder doing larger things. So I try to do both. When I'm in a group, I get into political discussions and grow from it. Also if your in a group its easier to start doing other radical work and organize other actions against the state.
MA: What is NMG working on right now that you want people to know about? How can people support your work?
NMG: Right now I'm working on the star pig posters (limited edition screen prints). It's gonna be about 11 or 12 different posters. And DOTS poster series is done and are for sale on the website. Also as always I am making free download posters, stencils and sticker masters for the website. I am going to do a Graf-zine of all East Bay Graf. And a graphic novel if my brother ever gets off his ass and gets his nuts together.
More info (and to download all of Modesto Anarcho #4), go to: www.geocities.com/anarcho209 or www.myspace.com/modanarcho, email us at: anarcho209@yahoo.com
